There's a Bear with slippers sitting on the edges of the pool! ®

FX:EURUSD   Euro / U.S. Dollar
Already mentioned previously, published and discussed, but I need it for my "logbook" :)

Patterns objective: Short at D

Pick your tools! ;)

Cypher Targets:
TP1 38.2% retracement of CD leg
TP2 61.8% retracement of CD leg

Gartley Targets:
TP1 38.2% retracement of AD leg
TP2 61.8% retracement of AD leg

Safe trades;

Sorry, according to the classic harmonic patterns trading rules, neither one of these patterns are valid. Cypher needs to be minimum 1.272 extension of XA. And your the B point of your Gartley exceeds the .786 retrace of XA which makes it a Butterfly. Not a Gartley. Not my opinions. These are Jason Stapleton's Cypher rules and Scott Carney's Gartley/Butterfly rules.

I state this not to criticize but to correct so that you and other people who may read this and think they are trading a proper cypher and/or Gartley and hope to profit from it don't end up losing money because they were actually trading incorrect patterns. So I hope you don't take offense. Just trying to help is all.....GL!
Trading_Jazz EverythingForex
You are absolutely right, if we look for values with accuracy, actually my ratios are the same from, but taking into account that these patterns are nothing more than a simplified way to predict elliot moves, I'm trying to find price zones and respective reactions, and not exact percentages of retraction or extension. The only "issue" is the name that we apply to it. And the discrepancy is not so significant, you can notice that on the Cypher here, I put the point C a little lower just in case :)

My ratios:

Trading_Jazz EverythingForex
And Thanks!! ;)
EverythingForex Trading_Jazz
First, that's a nice chart of the pattern ratios. Did you make it yourself? Hope you don't mind if I borrow it though I don't really need it as it's all in my head after having traded advanced patterns for a number of years now. Also, did you do that chart here using the tradingview tools or is that an external picture of a chart you got from somewhere else? If it's an external picture, how did you get it to show up here? I thought we could only paste pics of charts created here using tradingview tools?

Second, I have to take issue with the fact that you say these patterns are "nothing more than a simplified way to predict elliott moves". If you have followed my posts, you know that I use wave counts extensively in my trading. I agree that advanced patterns do have something to do with elliott waves as Scott Carney himself also says that he attributes much of his work to the masters such as Proctor, Gann and others. But advanced patterns are a method of trading all unto itself without regards to Elliott waves. Now, everyone is free to extrapolate for themselves how best to use these patterns. I incorporate these patterns in to my own trading method by using them to CONFIRM my own wave counts. For example, If I am thinking there is a wave 3 coming off a wave 2 that is finishing, if I can find a pattern that also confirms that move, then all the better.

Thirdly, that "discrepancy" that you are saying is not so significant, if you use that same logic with all your patterns, for example, that gartley whose ratios are really a butterfly, then the true D point (should be a butterfly according to your own rules chart above) has a 118 pip difference from your supposed Gartley. So say for example if someone were to take your advice and sell on that Gartley D point and prices kept going up to finish where it really should which is at the butterfly D point, they could end up in a losing trade.

Anyway, I don't want to get into a long discussion about this as you seem to have your own method. I'm just pointing out that going by the "names" you have given your "patterns", they are not correct. If you are using the ratios you used in your "cypher" and your "Gartley", then they aren't a cypher and gartley. For the sake of clarity, they should be named something else so as not to mislead those that are not so familiar with advanced patterns. GL!
+2 Reply
Trading_Jazz EverythingForex
Thank you for your advice, i really appreciate constructive comments.GL to you too.
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